Indivision ECS V2 ghosting

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Don't Panic. Please wash hands.
  • You see it also with Pinball Dreams. Pinball is a fast game for a Indivision ECS V2. On the Indivision AGA MK3 it don’t have ghosting. For the rest the Indivision ECS V2 works great on the BenQ BL702A monitor. Maybe the adapter can help the ghosting for Pinball Fantasies and Pinball Dreams.


    There a lot of games which have no ghosting with the Indivision ECS V2. For me the Indivision ECS V2 is far better than the old Indivision ECS V1.

    A1200 GHOST Rev2B RECAP TSB 2020 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 CD32 Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2019 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / ACA1234-50
    A1200 BLACK Rev2B RECAP TSB 2018 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 /
    Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 TRANSLUCENT Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2018 /
    CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK2CR / ACA1233-55 LE
    A500 BLACK Rev6A / CA-PSU / ACE2 / Indivision ECS V1-V2 / ACA500Plus V1-V2 / ACA1221 Rev1.3 / ACA1233n-55

    C64R MK1-MK2 TRANSPARENT 2015 DM / iComp 12V 2.0A / TC64 V1

  • You see it also with Pinball Dreams. Pinball is a fast game for a Indivision ECS V2. On the Indivision AGA MK3 it don’t have ghosting. For the rest the Indivision ECS V2 works great on the BenQ BL702A monitor. Maybe the adapter can help the ghosting for Pinball Fantasies and Pinball Dreams.


    There a lot of games which have no ghosting with the Indivision ECS V2. For me the Indivision ECS V2 is far better than the old Indivision ECS V1.

    So then you also have ghosting/shadowing. ECS V1 does not have noticeable ghosting for me. The problem is it's just not isolated to pinball dreams and fantasies. It depends upon background colours as to how visible the ghosting is. It has nothing to do with how fast the game is. It's not that type of ghosting we are talking about here. We are talking about a constant shadow on the right side of objects, depending on the colours as to how badly it shows. I get the same effect if I use a low quality/bad VGA cable on my ECS V1. However, using good VGA cables on the ECS V1 gives it a sharp picture with almost no noticeable ghosting. ECS V2 has quite bad ghosting no matter what cable one uses.


    As said by so many people in this thread. The issues shows perefectly in Phil's video. Everything points to ECS V2/TC64 V2 outputting a weak VGA signal. Effectively replicating the same effect you get by using a bad VGA cable on a unit with an acceptable/good VGA output signal.


    Please don't claim to not have ghosting/shadowing when you actually have the same problem all others here have with ECS V2/TC64 V2. The more people who report the problem, the more likely we are to get a fix for it.

  • Please don't claim to not have ghosting/shadowing when you actually have the same problem all others here have with ECS V2/TC64 V2. The more people who report the problem, the more likely we are to get a fix for it.

    You *will* get a fix. Get me a time-hole where I can sit in, work for 8 hours and when I come out, only two hours have passed outside. This will speed things up.


    If you try to let people see what is not there on the setup used, you actually lower my motivation. This is the most diplomatic way for me to put it.

  • So then you also have ghosting/shadowing. ECS V1 does not have noticeable ghosting for me. The problem is it's just not isolated to pinball dreams and fantasies. It depends upon background colours as to how visible the ghosting is. It has nothing to do with how fast the game is. It's not that type of ghosting we are talking about here. We are talking about a constant shadow on the right side of objects, depending on the colours as to how badly it shows. I get the same effect if I use a low quality/bad VGA cable on my ECS V1. However, using good VGA cables on the ECS V1 gives it a sharp picture with almost no noticeable ghosting. ECS V2 has quite bad ghosting no matter what cable one uses.


    As said by so many people in this thread. The issues shows perefectly in Phil's video. Everything points to ECS V2/TC64 V2 outputting a weak VGA signal. Effectively replicating the same effect you get by using a bad VGA cable on a unit with an acceptable/good VGA output signal.


    Please don't claim to not have ghosting/shadowing when you actually have the same problem all others here have with ECS V2/TC64 V2. The more people who report the problem, the more likely we are to get a fix for it.

    Have not the TC64 V2 only the TC64 V1 which have no ghosting. Maybe I will buy latter this year the TC64 V2 but my money is keep separate for the ACA1260. If it come out this year.


    You see on my pictures that it’s razor sharp and like it more than on my Indivision ECS V1. The only complain is the ACA500Plus menu which is not centre. Which is well center with the Indivision ECS V1. The Game picture with the Indivision ECS V1 is not filling the screen. And the Demos have distortion such as on the Indivision AGA MK2CR. With the Indivision ECS V2 and the Indivision AGA MK3 I can see the Demos to the end without distortion.


    And please don’t claim that you got right and I not. I’m happy with the Indivision ECS V2 and shall also buy the next upgrade and so on. There is always room to upgrade but for now it’s the best flicker fixer for the A500.



    A1200 GHOST Rev2B RECAP TSB 2020 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 CD32 Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2019 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / ACA1234-50
    A1200 BLACK Rev2B RECAP TSB 2018 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 /
    Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 TRANSLUCENT Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2018 /
    CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK2CR / ACA1233-55 LE
    A500 BLACK Rev6A / CA-PSU / ACE2 / Indivision ECS V1-V2 / ACA500Plus V1-V2 / ACA1221 Rev1.3 / ACA1233n-55

    C64R MK1-MK2 TRANSPARENT 2015 DM / iComp 12V 2.0A / TC64 V1

  • Have not the TC64 V2 only the TC64 V1 which have no ghosting. Maybe I will buy latter this year the TC64 V2 but my money is keep separate for the ACA1260. If it come out this year.


    You see on my pictures that it’s razor sharp and like it more than on my Indivision ECS V1. The only complain is the ACA500Plus menu which is not centre. Which is well center with the Indivision ECS V1. The Game picture with the Indivision ECS V1 is not filling the screen. And the Demos have distortion such as on the Indivision AGA MK2CR. With the Indivision ECS V2 and the Indivision AGA MK3 I can see the Demos to the end without distortion.


    And please don’t claim that you got right and I not. I’m happy with the Indivision ECS V2 and shall also buy the next upgrade and so on. There is always room to upgrade but for now it’s the best flicker fixer for the A500.



    Not filling the screen with most software is called overscan area. The Amigas is designed with an overscan area to allow software that uses the overscan area. Sure, you can fill the screen with the ECS V2 by using 640x512 etc. but as soon as you start a program/game that uses the overscan area much of the picture will dissapear outside of the screen.


    you show some pictures of hi-res workbench. As said, this ghosting/shadowing is showing better at some colours. I am not trying to convince you that you are not/should not be happy with the ECS V2. My point is we have a huge thread here that goes 2 years back, that clearly says there is alot of people not happy with the ghosting/shadowing that the ECS V2 has.


    I wanted you to provide a video or picture of pinball fantasies to see if you had the same ghosting Phil showed in his video. This ghosting is clearly visible depending on the software/games colours. At first you claimed your setup had no ghosting/shadowing, when in fact you in a later post claimed you had the same as in Phil's video with pinball fantasies, and you did not have it on your AGA MK3.


    Even if you don't mind this ghosting, this thread is full of people who are not very happy with it and find it distracting. Anyway, the point is made that you also indeed have the same ghosting/shadowing that the rest of us have. So at least there is no point trying to find out what differs in your system VS other systems. The problem is when someone come in to a thread like this and claims to not have the same issue/symptoms people start looking for differences/solutions because they believe you don't have the same issue, when in fact you have. Even if you don't look at it as a problem for you, this thread is full of people who thinks this is a problem, me included.


    Example, if you made the same video that Phil made, and showed no ghosting in a game like Pinball fantasies then we had something to work with. We could start to look closer as to why you did not have the ghosting all other people in this thread are seeing. Many of us even have the same monitors you have.


    The same problem occurs with the TC64 V2. I've see alot of reports of ghosting/shadowing. But then there is that one individual that claims to have no ghosting. Maybe they haven't tried software that shows it or maybe they don't care. More power to them, but claiming stuff like that can cause people to start searching for solutions that are not there. It causes confusion.

  • You change my words to fast and there is no ghosting on my Workbench. There is only little ghosting on two Pinball games. And that saw I also on the Indivision ECS V1. For 16 colors my Workbench looks great with BestClassicWB 1.5. And the WHDLoad Games and Demos run smooth.


    Can’t tell for the TC64 V2 which I don’t have. Like the TC64 V1 because it have VGA and have sharp picture on the BenQ BL702A monitor. Not all Games and Demos works great such on the 1541 Ultimate II. Use the TC64 V1 as cartridge on the C64 Reloaded MK1. Like the C64 Reloaded MK1 more than the C64 Reloaded MK2.


    You think that with the Indivision ECS V1 which I don’t like at all. For me the products of iComp is which work the best for the purpose you use.

    A1200 GHOST Rev2B RECAP TSB 2020 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 CD32 Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2019 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 / ACA1234-50
    A1200 BLACK Rev2B RECAP TSB 2018 / CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK3 /
    Blizzard 1230 IV

    A1200 TRANSLUCENT Rev1D.4 RECAP TSB 2018 /
    CA-PSU / Indivision AGA MK2CR / ACA1233-55 LE
    A500 BLACK Rev6A / CA-PSU / ACE2 / Indivision ECS V1-V2 / ACA500Plus V1-V2 / ACA1221 Rev1.3 / ACA1233n-55

    C64R MK1-MK2 TRANSPARENT 2015 DM / iComp 12V 2.0A / TC64 V1

  • JohanSSID  turrican9  Jens


    The ghosting is not only with Pinball Fantasies. I have it with a lot of games and demos. The pinball video I posted overhere some time ago was just an example because I don't want this topic is full of ghosting videos.


    Jens knows there's a problem, some can live with it, others like me and turrican are perfectionists and want the best for our Amiga's.


    Maybe is Johan the lucky guy without problems, we want be happy also :)

    It's nothing to do with the software you install. OS3.0; OS3.1; OS3.1.4; ClassicWB; BestWB don't solve our problem. It's a hardware problem. I posted here pictures some time ago from the kickstart screens of 3.1 and 3.1.4 where you see the ghosting when connecting the ECS V2 with VGA-cable. When I connect through the RGB-port of the Amiga and 'play' with the pixel-clock there's no ghosting at all. Not in games, not in demos, not on the kickstart screens. Just pull out your sd-card from the Aca500+ and show us your kickstart screen.

    This is not something I want to use to change everytime the VGA-cable from the ECS V2 to the RGB-port. The reason I bought the ECS V2 is that I use the Workbench screen in HighGFX-mode (and that's not supported through the RGB-port) and if I want to play a game or demo, just start WHDLoad without changing the cables.


    I know we must be happy there's still exellent hardware made from Individual Computers and like I said before, I'm super happy with all the hardware I bought last year for our lovely Amiga's, just this ECS V2 is a disappointment so far but it's workable.

    I will give Jens the time to find a solution for us all, and he will find it but I don't want to wait 2 years like the topic starter is now waiting for 2 years.


    Phil

    A1200 Rev2B AmigaOS 3.2| SanDisk CF64GB HDD | Blizzard 1230 IV 64MB FPU 68882/50 | Indivision AGA MK3 | CA-PSU | Eizo S1933 | Bose Companion 2 series III

    A500 Rev6A AmigaOS 3.2| SanDisk CF16GB HDD | ACA500Plus V2 / ACA1221lc | Indivision ECS V3 | ACE2b | CA-PSU | Eizo S1933 | Bose Companion 2 series III

    iAmiga 27" :huh: | AmigaOS 3.2 FS-UAE | SDD 1 TB | RTG by Picaso96 2560x1440

  • The only complain is the ACA500Plus menu which is not centre. Which is well center with the Indivision ECS V1.

    That's something you can change with the config tool. V1 did have a different default setting, but that was not perfect for other applications. Thing is that you can't be perfect for *all* applications, as the overscan area of the Amig is so big.


    As for "waiting time" - it's of course a matter of prioritites. And German GmbH-law puts administrative priorities very high. If you miss a deadline, you'll be fined.

  • hi jens,


    with so many problems about ghosting without solution, you should inform the potential buyers or have a solution to the problem. i bought the ecs v2 a month ago i put it in my amiga 500 with eizo ev2451 monitor and it goes ghosting in vga. the rgb is perfect.


    if i have read the post i would not have bought it since you do not have a solution yet.


    you have perfect products but with ecs v2 ………


    2 years from the first post...

  • Same here. I bought it in December basing purely on the YouTube reviews and the features promoted on the icomp website, and I only found out later IndiECSv2 is plagued with this. I'm pretty disappointed with the ghosting (which doesn't really bother me much in the workbench but in demos is very visible). I also have this: https://www.lighttech-hg.de/in…rojects/a2000-scandoubler scan doubler which gives me perfect picture quality yet it doesn't have scaler so image only takes a little over half of the screen... so no perfect solution here.
    I guess I will need to look for A2320 :(

  • More and more disappointed users here with a ghosting Indivision ECS V2.

    I saw it last week on several Facebook pages also. If you ask me, it's not a good sign.

    People especially remember the bad comments, all good items that Jens and his team make are quickly forgotten because of this.


    I think we are left in the cold here, we deserve a solution Jens.


    We know you are busy, make a little time for us in your calendar. <3

  • why not give us schematics and component types on what to solder where so people who are skilled in soldering could fix it themselves? Same goes for the TC64 V2 VGA output. I know you are afraid people will ruin their hardware, but since it's been over 2 years at least give us something to work with if you don't have the time for it.


    Funny thing here is you said the reason we have ghosting on ECS V2 and TC64 V2 is because of the modern strict CE rules with regards to noise from analogue outputs or something along those lines. Yet the MK3 does not have reported ghosting from it's VGA output. And it's a newer product. So clearly you have the solution.

  • why not give us schematics and component types on what to solder where so people who are skilled in soldering could fix it themselves?

    It's just too much - you need to replace the whole output amplifier, and that's not an option without an additional PCB.


    Yet the MK3 does not have reported ghosting from it's VGA output.

    That has a fully-integrated DAC - this does not compare to the discrete stage(s) of Indivision ECS V2 and Chameleon V2.

  • It's just too much - you need to replace the whole output amplifier, and that's not an option without an additional PCB.


    That has a fully-integrated DAC - this does not compare to the discrete stage(s) of Indivision ECS V2 and Chameleon V2.

    I see. Not to sound rude, but why did you release these products with this poor picture quality in the first place? Clearly you must have seen it?


    I would not mind a less sharp picture, but the smearing/shadows on the right side of objects is really bad. It equals to using a really bad VGA cable on a unit that has a good VGA output. The problem is no VGA cable or monitor will fix this since it's the output quality that is the problem here.


    Anyway, appart from the VGA output quality of the ECS V2 and TC64 V2 I am very happy with all other products I have bought from you. I hope we get a solution.

  • Not to sound rude, but why did you release these products with this poor picture quality in the first place? Clearly you must have seen it?

    No, the picture quality is not an issue here, and not for 99.9% of the customers out there. It's just a few people who are very loud on this forum, because they want a 30-year-old computer to produce 21st-century-crystal-clear output on a Retina display. I'm all willing to look at it, even offer the circuit board with the new output stage at cost, but with practically noone indicating to spend some extra money for new CE testing, we'll just accept returns and sell the units to people who are satisfied with the picture quality.

  • Im willing to pay money for patch board, I have an ECS V2 but am currently using my scan plus ecs which produces better quality ocs output with no ghosting (but looks terrible in ecs modes)


    I understand there would be a cost to you for development, certification and manufacture, it would only be fair you get paid for that.

  • Yes, I am also willing to pay for patchboards for my ECS V2 and my two TC64 V2s as I am not happy at all with the picture quality. As I said, if it was only that the picture was not so sharp it wouldn't be a big issue for me, but that shadowing trails on the sides of objects is just not acceptable for me.


    I added an example picture of how the shadowing looks on ECS V2 and TC64 V2. This happens no matter what monitor, VGA cable, or even with no VGA cable and just straight plug in a VGA to HMDI converter. This is not the case with ECS V1, TC64 V1, or AGA MK3s VGA output. Or even other competitive products or FPGAs with VGA out. Just the ECS V2 and TC64 V2. I have a hard time believing that you haven't seen this at icomp or that 99% of people are happy with this.


    This is exactly the same poor quality ghosting/shadowing you get if you use a bad VGA cable on something that has a good output quality to begin with. And again, this picture is not taken from any of the units, this is an example of the exact same effect. There are plenty of pictures in this forum taken from the units themselves.

  • It's just a few people who are very loud on this forum, because they want a 30-year-old computer to produce 21st-century-crystal-clear output on a Retina display.

    I don't think I'm too loud here. I say my thoughts and I am honest.

    I am just a bit disappointed with the image quality of moving images such as in games or demos. On the Workbench screen I now use a background where the ghosting is hardly visible.

    When things are good, I also say it here on the forum and in certain Facebook groups. I bought for more than €900 last year in your shop, only the Indi ECS V2 was a bit disappointing because the Indi AGA MK3 gives such an excellent image on the same (non-Retina) BenQ BL702a monitor. The CA-PSU's, ACA500Plus, ACA1221lc, IndiAGA MK3's, ACE2b's,... are all excellent products and I'm very happy that you produce such items.

    I want to pay for an upgrade when it comes, I just have the problem that I can not solder at all and when the time comes I want to send the card back if you can then adjust it for me (for a fee of course).

    A1200 Rev2B AmigaOS 3.2| SanDisk CF64GB HDD | Blizzard 1230 IV 64MB FPU 68882/50 | Indivision AGA MK3 | CA-PSU | Eizo S1933 | Bose Companion 2 series III

    A500 Rev6A AmigaOS 3.2| SanDisk CF16GB HDD | ACA500Plus V2 / ACA1221lc | Indivision ECS V3 | ACE2b | CA-PSU | Eizo S1933 | Bose Companion 2 series III

    iAmiga 27" :huh: | AmigaOS 3.2 FS-UAE | SDD 1 TB | RTG by Picaso96 2560x1440