Indivision ECS v2 and Video Toaster

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Don't Panic. Please wash hands.
  • Hi,


    Jens, do you have any idea which screenmode I need to promote or create to force the VideoToaster to work. I did one using 60hz 640x400 NTSC standard but still I got a Genlock Error when I try to run the Toaster software.


    I did create a video here.


    VideoToaster genlock error


    Just wondering after all these years if you know the right settings. It is the last part of building my super Amiga computer. Once I have my Toaster running it will be a dream done after 30 years waiting :).


    Thanks for your help, as always.


    regards


    :)

  • Hi,


    the splash-screen of Indivision indicates that you'Re attempting to run the VGA output into the Toaster. That can't work, as it's a VGA mode. What you should do is to use the DB23 output of the Amiga - that's fully sync to the Amiga chipset, and that's what Genlocks require.

  • Hi Jens,


    I did find a Indivision ECS v1 second hand and as you know, it uses the original Denise chip. Now Video Toaster syncs fines and I can have VGA and RGB 23 pins video output at the same time.


    Once this setup was running and tested (I spent a lot of hours to be 100% sure), I put back my Indivision V2 and....... genlock error again.


    Nobody uses VideoToasters anymore so, I dont think this is a big deal :) but, I was wondering what is missing from the original Denise chip that is not being used on the Indivision V2.


    I attached a screenshot. There you can see the small monitor is the RGB 23 pins Amiga port and the 24 inch monitor is the Indivision ECS v1. So, yes, I can play with the Toaster and the original Indivision.


    Just letting you know what I did find and trying to help.


    thanks


    Santi.

  • I can think of two things the Indivision V2 does differently from a real Denise.

    The first one is easy to check. The Genlock Audio bit is used to enable Graffiti emulation, I guess that feature should be switched off (not sure what the default configuration is), when doing GenLock thingies.


    The other might be a missing feature for the ZD (background indicator) pin in the emulation. Not sure if (and if yes? how) the video toaster would use this pin. This is ZD pin of Denise is connected to pin 14 (called PIXLSW) on the RGB output. Especially for ECS version of the Denise this pin can have a thousand and one different functions, not all emulated. One function is to determine what is background and what is foreground in the Amiga picture.


    I admit I don't know how the video toaster works on hardware level, so hard for me to tell what it fails to find exactly at this moment.

  • pwsoft, I know, it will be difficult to catch. If you guys have any idea and want to compile a new firmware or something to try out, let me know. I am here to help.


    On the other side, I dont know if you want to spend sometime finding this issue when nobody uses Toaster anymore. But I like what are you doing trying to implement Denise in the Indivision ECS V2.


    Thanks again for the support and let me know if you need something to test.


    :)

  • The Video Toaster uses only the signals from the A2000/A3000/A4000 Videoslot. The Toaster 4000 does use the extended video slot signals if plugged into an A4000. I don’t think that ZD is present on the video slot.

    Only other inputs are composite via the external BNC inputs and the parallel port lines available on the video slot for control purposes. The switcher screen is output by the Amiga chip set so it should show up on the flicker fixed output. In fact, the video effects are all created by the Amiga using its native graphics.

  • You are correct. It's labeled PixelSW and it does have a buffer and resistor in between the Denise and the Video Slot (at least it does on the A2000).

  • Just wanted to close this out. I tested the Indivision ECS v2 with my Video Toaster and disabling Graffiti mode (also tried disabling ECS mode) made no difference- Toaster continue to throw “unable to genlock” error.


    Thus the Indivision ECS v2 is incompatible with the Video Toaster while the v1 works perfectly.

  • I was also planning on using an Indivision ECS v2 with Video Toaster (the original card, not 4000). I happened to notice in SantiDarkG's video that the Indivision splash mentions multisync and horizontal/vertical sync. Are those what the Denise replacement is trying to sync against? If I'm understanding some other forum posts correctly, those aren't valid in genlock mode—sync has to happen against the composite sync. Does the Indivision ECS v2 support the 7.8kHz signal output in genlock mode? Is genlock mode supported at all irrespective of the Toaster software? I'd expected this would work since I saw a bunch of posts about people using Indivision ECS with Toasters, but now that I look again, those were all v1. Thanks for any help/insight you can offer.

  • sync has to happen against the composite sync.

    The Denise chip does not see any of the sync signals, but gets sync "pulses" with chip register writes. It will generate syncs internally from that, so in essence, yes, we do sync to whatever Agnus is telling us, and that's in line with CSync.

    Does the Indivision ECS v2 support the 7.8kHz signal output in genlock mode?

    Since I never heard about a 7.8kHz signal before (on what output would that be?), I tend to say "no". Do you have a pointer to literature about this signal?


    Is genlock mode supported at all irrespective of the Toaster software?

    Basic Genlocking is supported in terms of the PixelSW (=Zero-detect) signal toggling properly when colour#0 is shown. The new ECS modes for this signal are only partially implemented and not tested at all, because we don't have any test setup.


    The V1 hardware still uses the original Denise chip, so whatever is generated for the Amiga's RGB port comes from the original chip - there's no way the V1 hardware can influence that. The V2 hardware completely replaces the Denise chip, potentially introducing a Genlock incompatibility.

  • Since I never heard about a 7.8kHz signal before (on what output would that be?), I tend to say "no". Do you have a pointer to literature about this signal?

    I don't no; just trying to piece things together from that discussion on the NewTek forums (with users, not NewTek employees), which mentions the sync dropping down to 7.8kHz in genlock mode. That references the VueTech Sync Strainer, which says this in its manual:

    When the Sync Strainer senses a gen-lock condition, as when NewTek’s Video Toaster is started, the Sync Strainer creates new H- and V-sync’s from composite sync. If the Amiga is in a high scan rate mode (31.4kHz), Toaster will not be able to start up. This is not a problem with the Sync Strainer. The user should first switch back to the “NTSC Hi-Res” mode from the “Prefs” icon. Should you attempt to start Toaster while the Amiga is not in an NTSC-compatible mode, performing a warm boot will guarantee that the Amiga does come up in a proper scan mode.

    I'm new to the Amiga, so apologies if anything I'm saying doesn't quite makes sense, as I'm still figuring things out. Thanks again for your time!


    https://forums.newtek.com/show…740&viewfull=1#post678740

    http://amiga.resource.cx/exp/syncstrainer

  • Just wanted to close this out. I tested the Indivision ECS v2 with my Video Toaster and disabling Graffiti mode (also tried disabling ECS mode) made no difference- Toaster continue to throw “unable to genlock” error.


    Thus the Indivision ECS v2 is incompatible with the Video Toaster while the v1 works perfectly.

    I just remembered this error can be caused by not having anything connected to the RGB port. Do you hit this with the v2 installed with something connected to the RGB port, or an RGB terminator?