What Terminal Program for X-Surf 500? (BBSing)

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  • I have an ACA500Plus and the X-Surf 500.

    It's online and connects to Individual Computers page, but that's about it.


    I've tried DCTelnet 1.7 and that won't run, it may require a 68020.


    I just want to get on some ANSI BBS's nothing more than that.

    Does anyone that uses this to get on BBS's have any suggestions?

  • Firstly, check out this guide - including links to telser.device - and use it to get any terminal program running (that will run on a 68000, which is many) and connected to a BBS. Ignore the bit about not having AmiTCP because you have that.


    Secondly, there's a lot more to do with a network connection than using a terminal program for anything: FTP, Samba, NFS, mod streaming (IMP), update checks (eg WHDLoad) and even web browsing (if you set your expectations low).

  • What was the X-surf 500 designed for if there aren't any supporting terminal programs?

    Ethernet is just the physical layer for networking in general, and you've even got a free AmiTCP license with it (which was not the case for all previous networking cards that were even more expensive). So instead of delivering the sana2 device only, we deliver the TCP/IP stack, so networking programs (browsers, FTP clients, network file systems) can talk to that.


    On any other computer, you wouldn't use a "terminal program", but a telnet client. I have pointed to the serial.device-like device because you used the term "terminal program", and I probably should have mentioned telser.device as well, because that's the one that we've been using back in the days.


    If you really want to use a stand-alone program, then Napsaterm might be worth a look. Not sure if that runs on 68000, but it includes the source code, so you're free to re-compile it for 68000.


    Jens

  • I certainly have telser.device selected in Term 4.8 as the device to use, but it just never actually makes a connection to the network card i'm guessing. I installed tesler.device and selected AmiTCP and just ran through all the defaults which installed fine.


    Here's a screen shot...

    https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/z7cka9c9kcbqdmmbram95/2024-10-30-17.04.19.jpg?rlkey=b02zw0ro8j2wrqbsa5bm26rbg&dl=0

  • Basic problem: Didn't read the documentation. Try the telser.guide file :-)


    If you want to dial to a different port, then you don't separate that with a colon, but with a comma. I just tried that exact BBS with an ACA500plus, 68000@14MHz, NComm and telser.device, and I could see the first screens of the BBS - it just didn't accept pressing ESC twice. Seems like NComm translates that key somehow wrong, but the rest works.


    Jens

  • This is NComm 2.0, and I recommend NOT to use that, as it obviously doesn't send the ESC key correctly. The only reason why I used this version was that it's on this install, which has evolved from my A1200 install that I've used in the 1990s. Before we developed the ACA500plus and networking cards, I often transferred files through ZModem and a nullmodem cable, and NComm 2.0 was good enough for that.


    I even "dialed" manually using:


    Code
    1. atdt absinthebbs.net,1940


    so not using any of the magic that the terminal program adds (I believe that's still setup for my US Robotics Courier modem!). Term will work if you replace the colon with a comma, I'm sure. I didn't do anything different than you did (I assume), because I used the installer for telser.device and I copied the free key file (also from Aminet) to S:. The keyfile may not even be required, as that only allows you to use more than one unit. For dialling out, you will hardly need more than one unit. If you want to set up an Amiga BBS on the net and allow multi-node logins, the keyfile is a "must".


    Jens

  • Ok, so I was able to get Term 4.8 working and after a little color adjustment and screen size tweaking it now looking like the BBS's should look.

    (I needed 640x200 and 16 colors enabled)


    I want to thank everyone for the help, this was an interesting puzzle for sure...

  • One thing I have noticed is that with BBSing over the X-Surf is how poor the performance is. I can pick different connection speeds up to 115,000. 38000, 9600 baud. None of them are any faster than 9600 Baud even thought the connection speed is faster.


    Does this have to do with it running through the telser.device driver?

  • The baud rate setting does nothing - communication is as fast as the TCP/IP stack and your connection allow it to be. Then of course, it depends on the other side's speed. I'd recommend setting up a "nullmodem" connection between two Amigas on your local net, but that's abit more effort editing AmiTCP config files to run a deamon.


    Jens

  • Just wanted to add a screen shot for a speed test. This I assume is not using telser.device as it's just from the workbench using AmiSpeedTest...

    Seems very slow?

    Edited once, last by Jens: Please upload pictures to the forum directly, so they stay here for archival purpose. ().

  • 1. please upload pictures to the forum, as external hosters will most likely delete the picture at some point in the future and remove important context of this thread.


    2. please mention the CPU speed you're running at - and always keep in the back of your head that most people actually deemed it impossible to run networking software on a 68000 (most networking software is compiled for 68020+).


    Jens

  • Pic uploaded.....


    I have BBS network access on my Commodore 64 (Via Ultimate II+ cartridge) and that works fine, so while I know the 68000 is slow by today's standards it's certainly faster than the 6510 in the C64 isn't it?

    Just seems like those speed are really really slow, even for old hardware.


    Would adding a ACA1221lc help with network stack speeds? (Currently Amiga 500 Rev6a with ACA500Plus/XSurf at 14mhz - I also tried 21 mhz and the speeds were the same)

  • so while I know the 68000 is slow by today's standards it's certainly faster than the 6510 in the C64 isn't it?

    The C64 is slower, right, but it doesn't do the work on it's own. The Ultimate cart is using a co-processor with 160MHz, running the TCP/IP stack (it's an ESP8266 if I remember right). That's quite a difference to a 14MHz 68000 that has to do the heavy lifting of layer-3 networking operations on it's own.

    Would adding a ACA1221lc help with network stack speeds? (Currently Amiga 500 Rev6a with ACA500Plus/XSurf)

    Yes.


    Jens

  • Do those network speeds in the screenshot look normal?

    Do you have any rough guess of what network speeds a ACA1221lc would be able to do? Double? 20%?


    If the CPU was the bottleneck wouldn't ramping up the CPU speed return better speeds?

  • Just anecdotally, I didn't have an X-Surf when I only had an ACA500plus, but with an ACA1234 running at 50MHz on the same AmiSpeedTest my results are consistently about 5x as fast as what you're getting.


    ...And every BBS I've connected to so far has been at 115,000 Baud.


    (To clarify, the ACA1234 is connected to the ACA500plus on my Amiga 500 Rev 6)

  • Just anecdotally, I didn't have an X-Surf when I only had an ACA500plus, but with an ACA1234 running at 50MHz on the same AmiSpeedTest my results are consistently about 5x as fast as what you're getting.


    ...And every BBS I've connected to so far has been at 115,000 Baud.

    Ok, that's good info. So I would think I should see at least double the performance. I already ordered the ACA1221lc. The ACA1234 seems like too much performance... but now you have me rethinking that choice :)


    We're really only talking about Workbench performance right? (Oh and Network stack)... Games aren't going to have any benefit with the 030?


    Are there any downsides to running the ACA1234 over the ACA1221lc? Compatibility?

  • My bad. More like 6x or more performance.



    Games - specifically many 3D games that rely on the CPU - are very much benefitted by the 030. Everything else is very much benefitted by the (with the ACA500plus) 134MB of FastRAM. I've never used my RAM: drive so much in my life, and my teenage self would be weeping at how much more usable something like Sculpt4D is.


    I haven't noticed any compatibility issues that haven't been dealt with by either WHDLoad or the adding of tooltypes (eg NOCACHE etc) to a particular WHDLoad slave as required. My biggest issue at the moment is that the ACA500plus has the ability to turn off the ACA1234, but my Workbench has (apparently) a bunch of 020+ stuff that runs on boot that I need to troubleshoot. But really, that's on me.


    Lastly, I went with the ACA1234 (and the 50MHz version at that) because if I was gonna spend a bunch of money on the best "real Amiga" experience I could have, I didn't want to die wondering, y'know? One day I'll get another Amiga and put a PiStorm in it just to see what that's like, but at the moment my ACA500plus/ACA1234-50/X-Surf-500/RGBtoHDMI/Gotek Amiga 500 is everything I could have ever hoped for. All I need now is a clockport AHI compatible sound card. HINT HINT

  • The last reply was more than 365 days ago, this thread is most likely obsolete. It is recommended to create a new thread instead.